I just read that I can't usea FM Runtime app's over the network (with other users) unless we use FM Server 7? Is this correct?

I'm not even sure that runtimes will work with Server -- never tried that. But in general, no, runtimes don't work over networks. They are stand-alone programs.

Dan

I believe server 7 still has the capability to support run times over the network (There is a tab for it in the properties dialog).

You would need to set them up to be multi user and each client would need FileMaker Pro on their machine. Thus we ask ourselves why would we want to do this?

Then what's the point of Filemaker Developer? None of your programs can be multi-user? For any busniess this is crap.. I have to buy a copy of FM for each client?

You could use the web?

But developer is there as a tool for you the developer. It allows you to analyze your database, debug scripts, create your own custom functions to name but a few.

It also allows you to create a standalone single user database that does not need FileMaker that you can then sell your solution to the general public.

Sell to the general public except anyone with a network. If they have a network then you must add about 200 (or so) dollars to the price (per machine). No wonder Filemaker has such a small market share. But no matter.. thanks for the info.

FileMaker has a HUGE market share in some sectors: education, arts, media (like file, television, radio). The kind of organisations that can't afford to spend $1,000,000 on an SQL system that never gets finished or, if it does get finished, doesn't do what they want and forces them to create FMP databases to fill the gaps.

There are a lot of FMP databases out there that fill gaps in big-iron systems. FMI picked up on that years ago, that's why they have been concentrating on IWP and XML and LDAP and all that stuff that a lot of stand-alone system developers have never understood.

BTW there is a pattern here: FMP is strong in those industries that originally had a strong Macintosh user base, despite the fact that they may all be Wintel shops now.

Oh please

Vaughan said:

...The kind of organisations that can't afford to spend $1,000,000 on an SQL system that never gets finished or...

...that fill gaps in big-iron systems...

In my view, this is the crux of it. FM is a great product for people with some aptitude who don't have the time/willingness/desire to learn SQL or other tools, and who have to do development themselves because of money or time constraints.

Another good niche for FM is in environments where a developer has to spend a lot of time developing business logic, and would like a tool that already has a built-in GUI and other standard features. At our firm, if we had to spend a lot of time working out user-operability issues like creating buttons, building interfaces/layouts from code, etc. we wouldn't have much time to work on the business logic. (US and state tax code--and you thought C++ could be confusing!)

I wouldn't use a saw to pound a nail, and there are, of course, scenarios where SQL is a better option. There are also scenarios where FM is a better option, even with all the extra costs you detailed. Maybe it's just not the right tool for your current project?

FWIW.

Jerry

You are conveniently ignoring the licensing costs associated with legal, commercial copies of MySQL. If you are willing to give me the code for your application when I ask for it, MySQL is free. Otherwise, you need to pay for a commercial license. MySQL is NOT free for commercial applicatons. Read their licensing requirements.

If you have a large user base, you could simply buy an Advanced Server version of filemaker, which can be served through the web up to 100 users. You only need to buy 2 version, one is advanced server and the other is the developer or normal version of Filemaker. The cost will be significantly less than buying the server edition with multiple individual filemaker pro licenses.

By the way, does anyone know how much does Filemaker 7 Advanced Server cost?

I believe it is in the region of $2500 for Server 7 advanced

The cost of 1 MySQL is $495.00 one time fee. Period. That's is easy to build into the cost of any app.

It doesn

Yeah, that restriction's always been there. I heard a rumor that someone found a way to simulate network access. Basically each user had a copy of the compiled solution on their machine. The data was held at a central point on the network in xml files. Data was accessed and edited via xml / xpath requests. That's all the information I have on that, and it sounds like it would be pretty complicated to set up.

Crag said:Now I

Filemaker has a high "application" cost, but a very low development and deployment cost.

That would depend on how much you charge.

This is interesting, I did not know that run time apps have the limit of being stand-alone. Though does this also mean single user? only one user at a time can open the FM runtime file at a time?

Also what is the format of a FM run time application, just a single executable, portable directory or something that has to be installed?

Thank You,

David

Run time apps are classed as stand alone because they do not require FileMaker to run them. An FM runtime is an executable application including its other parts which are all contained in a "portable directory".

A runtime can however be set up as multi user in FileMaker Preferences and shared via FileMaker Server only. This way you CAN have multi user run times. However as stated earlier this requires each client machine to have FileMaker installed.

That's $495/server. For centrally managed databases, that may be the end of it. But what if I try to do what I can do with Filemaker - some of the solutions are centrally hosted, but some run as single user on my laptop or desktop. The part timer in the next cube whips up a label template. Now how many licenses?

Ouch! - this is a 'show' stopper for me.. I have application running on InterBase ranging from 5-15 users sometimes connecting via VPN from different locations, I get many inquiries from Mac users for Mac version...I was hoping FM Dev was my key to getting things done.. back to the drawing board :-)

Crag,

It takes far less time to develop database apps in FM than in RealBasic.

Why do you advise your clients to get Developer? They don't need it. Are you developing the app or are they? Does your competitor give them a copy of RealBasic?

I also believe FileMaker sells a Server+10 license pack for about $2500. At least they used to. You could also Develop a web app and put them on FM Server Advanced for only $2500.

It's up to you, but FileMaker can not stay in business by selling you a $500 DBMS package and let you distribute unlimited clients. That's why the restriction has been in place since Developer version 4. Version 3 FM SDK allowed this, and their customers were buying one copy and deploying thousands of clients. No commercial database package can offer this and stay in business.

If you think you can get a RealBasic DB client done in the same timeframe and with the same functionality as FileMaker, then by all means, do it. But I think you'll find your time saved using FM is worth a lot more than the cost of FM server + clients. But hey, it's your choice.