Filemaker and Database Driven Websites

[Eliz309]

We have been working with a company to develope a website that links to a database containing the product that we sell, where our customers can view the product, then place an order. Needless to say we are having problems with the company now. As I understand it our set up is that we go to the admin page on the website, click a button and the database on the server will update the website. The company that we are using is acting like we have asked them to perform some miracle. We are now having to entertain the idea that we might need to have someone else complete this project, but we are concerned that if we do not get the coding for database link that we will lose a significant amount of money and time.

Can anyone provide any information as to how indepth this process is and what our expectations should be? We feel like this company is taking a long time because they don't know how to do the work, but they are blaming it on FM and us. We don't know because we really don't understand the process of linking FM to a website.

[Garry Claridge]

You can do this in a number of ways:

1. Have the database hosted with a hosting service that hosts FM.

2. Host the database yourself with a fixed IP.

3. Use a commonly hosted database, such as MySQL, and "sync" the data with your FM database.

All the best.

Garry

[ibiubu]

Sounds like you are describing a store front and shopping cart scenario.

To build one of these may not be that complicated, but they do usually take a lot of time to create from scratch.

But why try to re-invent the wheel? There are NUMEROUS companies now that specialize in providing existing backend hosting of store fronts with shopping carts. Generally you pay them a monthly fee. You use their existing web interface to enter your items into the store database. You specify things such as price, description, photos, etc. They also provide a shopping cart that is already in place. And since they specialize in offering this service, why spend the money developing your own system.

A couple of examples of this type of company:

http://www.monstercommerce.com

http://demo.dynamicstorefront.com

http://www.empsebiz.com

http://www.shoppingcartsplus.com

Larry

[Eliz309]

Thanks for the information. I think that the company that is creating the website is using MySQL and syncing the data with the FM database.

I think that the reason that they are creating this from Scratch my be because we want to make it so that anyone can see the product information. our customers can then log in see the pricing, create a customized quote for their clients, save that for later, then turn it into an order and send it into us.

But I will take a look at the options that Larry listed and see if we can use any. If anything atleast I have a little better understanding of what we are looking at if we have to cut loose this web designer.

Thanks,

Elizabeth

[Steve T.]

Hi, Elizabeth! I think Garry (and Larry?) do this for a living professionally and could probably finish the job for you if you don't get any further w/the others. FM web serving is relatively easy but financial transactions complicate things quite a bit since professional cyber hackers are looking for targets. Because of this, I think most professional security options are designed for Apache + PHP/MySQL type systems.

If I were doing the sync-ing for myself in your situation, I might make a FileMaker-served web page that could execute a FileMaker script to export all/changed data to a text file. I would then have a 2nd PHP web page to import the data into MySQL. From a casual persepective, I would not think this is that hard but I am familiar with both FileMaker and PHP/MySQL now. Hopefully, there is a default format both FM and MySQL can share; otherwise another script may be needed to tweak the data before importing to MySQL. A lot also depends on what version of FM is being run... FM7 is very different from FM 4-6.

Ciao!

--ST

[Eliz309]

Hi Steve,

I am glad that you mentioned the Apache systems as that is what the web developers were using for our site and our host did not support that. Since my last post we have parted ways with the company designing our site. I know nothing about web developement and am far from an expert in filemaker so this whole process is a little unfamiliar to me. We are just trying to get a feel for hoe involved this project should be. Our previous web developer acted as if Filemaker was a problem. If there are any suggestions for things that we should look for in a new person I would appreciate the help.

[Steve T.]

RE: Our previous web developer acted as if Filemaker was a problem.

Howdy! FileMaker was not originally designed for web publishing. IMO, its strength is in its ease-of-use and empowerment of an average user. FM allows someone with basic computer skills to create powerful databases and custom layouts relatively easily... you don't have to be a programmer/scripter to get good results. As FM grew in popularity in the office and when the internet explosion came around, FM4 allowed the average user to web publish databases, and that blew my socks off! Instant Web Publishing took no web skills at all. Custom Web Publishing allowed someone who knew how to create web pages to add a little CDML code to their pages and customize their web solutions to handle most of the basic web-db tasks (search engines, input forms, e-mails, etc.).

Today, however, many folks want more, and databases like MySQL are not graphical-interface end-user applications, nor were they meant to be so. Web developers used to PHP/MySQL (and other types of command-line systems) are used to scripting/programming, so applications like FileMaker Pro may seem too different for them. In situations when you are using Apache as your webserver application, you need to use "middleware" such as PHP to take web form data and process it into a form that FileMaker (or other databases such as MySQL) will understand. PHP and MySQL are both open source technologies that work well together and may be more comfortable for programmers familiar with the C (or similar) programming language.

For serving data on the web or taking web form data from web users, the Apache/PHP/MySQL combo is hard to beat, but getting that data from MySQL into a usable form for the office end-user is not so easy. It also takes a much higher level of technical expertise to develop such sites IMO than FM sites. In fact, if you're not a programmer or interested in learning some programming, I'd probably not recommend it for the average computer user. FileMaker Pro, on the other hand, already has the end-user taken care of, so if it can be used as the web database, too (instead of, for example, MySQL), then it becomes a much more desirable candidate because of its versatility and end-user features already included.

FileMaker out-of-the-box can web publish without any programming experience required. FMP 4-6 had a limited but relatively easy scripting language called CDML that allowed a basic web designer to add a little code to their web pages to have great database-driven websites. Pro developers could use CDML in conjunction with JavaScript or other technologies to get around some of CDML's higher end shortcomings; some even used PHP w/FileMaker... in fact a developer by the name of Chris Hansen created a PHP class for other PHP developers called FX.php that they could use to facilitate their use of PHP with FileMaker.

Today, FM7 has apparently improved the built-in Instant Web Publishing option but phased out CDML, which in my opinion has empowered the non-programmer somewhat but at the cost of pushing out the intermediate web publisher. IMO, FM7 Advanced Server is trying to make a leap into the higher end but you really need to be a programmer/scripter to build custom solutions via XML/XLST (which I hope to learn someday... later).

So, if you want to use FileMaker Pro and serve it directly on the internet, you have to either find a web hosting company that hosts FileMaker Pro databases, or you have to publish it in-house from your own internet connection from your own server. (BTW, a "server" can be as simple as an old hand-me-down computer or as high end as a multi-thousand-dollar super machine... "server" just describes the computer's primary purpose.) If you do it in-house, you can either link to it from your existing main site or you can run your entire site in-house. A simple, low traffic site can be done in FM4 alone; a high-end busy site may require Apache/PHP/FM with multiple servers; or you can go anywhere in between.

If you use FileMaker Pro every day (like we do) and want to integrate it with your website in some fashion, you'll probably want to find a web developer familiar with FileMaker Pro and how it works. FM7SA is new and costly; FM4 is old and cheap. Apache, PHP, and MySQL are "open source" that may not cost you anything beyond hardware and time but IMO are definitely for programmers only. If you don't know where to look, ask on these forums (or the FMFORUMS Classifieds forum), or see who answers most of the questions and is respected by the advanced users, or check out some of those FMFORUMS banner ads. Lots of great resources here on FMFORUMS.COM!!

--ST

[kfutter]

A nice round-up Steve, but if you'll permit, I'll make a small technical correction: CDML is a markup language, not a scripting language (that is, after all, what the 'ML' stands for). They're very different animals.

Cheers,

Kevin

[Ivan Tan]

Programming is not for ordinary folks.

Instant web publishing is easy and user friendly.

Server advance is not different from instant web publishing but serving more people once it is configured properly.

It's all about the cost of development and time to shelf. Most solutions that filemaker can create is out of this world. I can create a web database and polished it in a day with security logon.

Difficult to achieve with programming.

[Zero Tolerence]

Server Advanced allows the use of XML publishing, which is a HUGE difference. And if your talking about a shopping cart, you dont' want to go IWP, where the nubmer of connections is limited to 100. You want to explore XML publishing, most likely through lasso. LDML is not very hard to learn, and If your looking for someone to program this you need to state that. I am great at programming FM sites, I do, however, suck at trying to make anything artistic.

Many times there is a big differense between a web Programmer and a Web Designer.